Author Topic: Geek Talk  (Read 120914 times)

mo

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1335 on: May 15, 2018, 05:04:32 PM »
I'd be okay with some ads too, but allowing a bunch of unknown third-party domains to scripts is just insane,  even though it is SOP. Apparently that is the only way ads can be offered up.

Did you see the Buzzfeed article about the industry built on gaming the review system on Amazon? It's just gotten ridiculous. There's probably someone gaming the gamers. You can't trust anything, and there's little point in participating in anything, unless you go in all the way.
It's symbolic of our struggle against reality.

mo

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1336 on: May 15, 2018, 06:00:57 PM »
And then, after bashing the internet, Ratman, by Moebius.
It's symbolic of our struggle against reality.

Dr. Leonard HmofCoy

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1337 on: May 15, 2018, 06:50:27 PM »
As Neal Stephenson once observed, the suburban night contains much weird beauty if you just care to look.

I found, in under a minute, a scanned copy of a short story published in Omni in 1979, because the recent decision of World Rugby to disqualify Romania *and* Spain from the World Cup called it to mind.

I am working hard on ignoring all the parts of the Internet that do not please me, and this does let me enjoy its features more from time to time.
"Parasitic wasps laying eggs in other insects is a better love story than Twilight." - :bitzero:
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random axe

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1338 on: May 16, 2018, 04:04:39 PM »
That's the whole thing.  It's full of treasure, but it's like a tourism town where all the main attractions are actually shit.  You gotta know where to eat and where not to eat.

MEANWHILE . . . a link started appearing on Reddit pages that says Visit Old Reddit.  :lol:  NICE.  You put "old." at the beginning of a Reddit URL, and you get the old version . . .  except even better.  For instance, the mobile version is now the desktop version, which was always better (at least on my mobile) than the mobile version.

Some of the links on an old.reddit page go to the regular new Reddit link instead of the corresponding old.reddit version, which is forgiveable.  BUT it's basically what I was saying they ought to do.  So unless it vanishes in three months, terrific.


Quote
Did you see the Buzzfeed article about the industry built on gaming the review system on Amazon?

No, but I've seen similar.  Amazon is a hot mess.  We recently 'sold' an expensive thing where Amazon's software decided it had a better photo than our scan of the item, so it changed the picture . . . to something not the same.  And a customer bought it.  And then was understandably mad that we shipped them the wrong thing.

This happens periodically, and sometimes Amazon tells us they've changed our listing for us, and sometimes they don't. 

There are a lot of things they don't police well.  Not just them, but they want to be the top dog.  For instance, sometimes a merchant will pretend to be twelve different merchants and list a single copy of an item twelve times with almost identical prices.  Then, if you search for that item, they spam the shitty search function.  Places like ABE Books, it makes the entire first page of listings entirely the same single vendor.  At Amazon, it makes it look like there are a ton of cheap sellers when there aren't.

That crap is done with software, so it's easier for some schlub to game Amazon than to actually sell a bunch of stuff.  :shrug:

mo

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1339 on: May 16, 2018, 07:01:05 PM »
I thought you were supposed to be able to choose 'old reddit' in your preferences. I don't know, as I said, I've been fortunate enough to have not been switched over yet.

The Amazon fake review article was pretty fascinating. I don't normally read Buzzfeed articles.
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The systems that create fraudulent reviews are a complicated web of subreddits, invite-only Slack channels, private Discord servers, and closed Facebook groups, but the incentives are simple: ... merchants are willing to pay thousands of people to review their products positively. https://www.buzzfeed.com/nicolenguyen/amazon-fake-review-problem

Quote
I am working hard on ignoring all the parts of the Internet that do not please me...

I've been trying to avoid the stuff designed to make the viewer angry for years now, like by scanning headlines and skipping articles that I know will piss me off, but now even the headlines are enough to get me going. It's tough to dodge the aggravation.

When I first started exploring the internet, I would get sucked in every time and lose hours going down rabbit holes. Now I have a hard time killing 30 minutes, unless it's fighting the improvements, like trying to actually view something or find something. It used to be so much easier.
It's symbolic of our struggle against reality.

flipper

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1340 on: May 16, 2018, 07:29:00 PM »
I tend to avoid normies (not HMOF) and stick with a short list of curators.  I get a lot of laughs from the people I follow on twitter and facebook.  I still listen to podcasts at work and follow several youtubers I like.  I've resigned myself to accepting that I'm missing out on tons of stuff but happy that what I do catch is usually pretty good.
"It all trickles down from the hot sex. I'm not saying you don't need cheese, just that if you concentrate on the hot sex, the cheese will follow. Naturally."--PsiDefect 03-19-2002 11:28 AM

random axe

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1341 on: May 17, 2018, 09:21:06 AM »
If you're getting good stuff from the internet on a per-minute basis and at a relatively low cost, you're way ahead of the game.

mo

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1342 on: May 17, 2018, 04:06:41 PM »
By strange coincidence, I was presented with a link to the geocities tumblr archive today. I've seen links to it many times, but I was only in the mood (after the conversation here) to spend any time there. Beyond the terrible design, there's a lost magic there, something equivalent to the allure of a "grab bag", the aforementioned rabbit holes, and the sense that there are strange and interesting people out there, not just different groups of opposing agendas.

I get a lot of laughs from the people I follow on twitter and facebook.

I have no doubt you have a great compilation of people, and I'm a bit envious, but I don't think I regret missing what you have been through to get there. I guess I want my cake without the shit topping of FB and twitter.
It's symbolic of our struggle against reality.

random axe

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1343 on: May 18, 2018, 08:52:37 AM »
For me, the infuriating qualities of Facebook utterly drown out the value of the good content.  I just can't.  It's like, "Hey, we have this awkward party line you can use to talk to your friends and some other people who, OK, some of them are cool, but, anyway, you have to have this electrified eggplant shoved up your ass while you use it, and also loud advertisements and Facebook frosting will be sprayed at you constantly."


What ruins Twitter for me is that CONSTANTLY CONSTANTLY CONSTANTLY aggregator sites have an interesting headline, and then the link just goes to a Tweet that recapitulates the headline or otherwise has nothing additional to offer.

Never mind that Twitter's presentation has turned to hot garbage.


It all goes back to signal-to-noise.  The more things change, the more chrome gets layered on and drags the paper airplane to the bottom of the sea.

pdrake

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1344 on: May 18, 2018, 11:04:08 AM »
I've found I can take FB about once or twice a day. I scroll through my feed and that's pretty much it.

I NEVER do those stupid quizzes. Maybe that's why none of my info was stolen.
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mo

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1345 on: May 18, 2018, 03:12:22 PM »
Maybe that's why none of my info was stolen.

That would depend on your definition of info. Or stolen. They've acquired a lot of info on you, just not as much as from those that answered those quizzes.
It's symbolic of our struggle against reality.

random axe

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1346 on: May 19, 2018, 10:03:37 AM »
Very little of what went into my Fbook page was true or even pseudo-true, sooo . . . they got a lot of data that doesn't correlate very well. 

However, I'm sure most of the data and data analysis they sell is garbled crap.  If the companies that bought it had the time and skill to verify that it was any good, they wouldn't need to buy it from Fbook / Google / Amazon /  etc.  So there's no incentive for the data vendors to produce particularly good data, only to market it well.

Propagandists would like us to think that the CamAnal scandal is about privacy because they figure there's nothing we can do about privacy, and we'll just get used to it.  But it's not a privacy scandal.  The scandals involved are:

A)  Facebook, et al, dealing in bad faith, and most people not clueing in.

B)  Corporations like CamAnal springing up to game society in order to circumvent economics, politics, culture, etc, to any end, for money.

C)  Politicians, et al, rushing to use corporations like CamAnal to circumvent economics, politics, culture, etc.

I doubt CamAnal's product was actually worth the money.  It's mostly hype.  But it's a fundamentally antisocial product; it's not like prior market analysis products because of how it differs in sourcing, scale, and application, but to the extent it is like prior systems, those prior systems were also unethical, scummy, antisocial, and essentially evil.

But CamAnal gives bad actors the veneer of commerce and common practice necessary to reach for new ways to gerrymander, suppress voters, go racist / etc, and generally waste vast, vast sums of money being anti-democratic and foul.  Which is the real scandal. 

Facebook works hard to deceive its users in order to take value from them without their knowledge.  That's a scandal.  Facebook sells that value (perceived or real) to corporations that specifically intend to do bad things with it.  That's a scandal.  Politicians rush to exploit those corporations in order to game the public and subvert our entire political system.  That's a scandal.  Then pundits lie and say the outrage should be that CamAnal knows what you Liked.  And that, too, is a scandal -- the lie, not the data.

random axe

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1347 on: May 19, 2018, 10:07:39 AM »
Anyway, my current Facebook hatred is that they allow visitors to our commercial pages to Suggest Changes.  Then we have 14 days to reject changes, or else they go into effect.

We get probably two suggestions per week, and I don't think one has ever yet been correct.  Also, Facebook doesn't always remember to email us to notify us.  And according to Facebook, you can't turn off this 'feature'.

Sure.  Not amateur-hour at all.

mo

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1348 on: May 19, 2018, 04:42:20 PM »
The value of all that info is really tough to pin down, beyond the obfuscation factor. We’re in the early days of figuring out what to do with it, like electricity at the turn of the century. The amount that’s been harvested, by whatever means, compared to the amount that has been leveraged is astronomical. Our personal info sits on hard drives all over the world, in the hands of people that don’t know how to leverage it. Their inability is not much consolation to me. Trying to determine if some info or record of behavior of mine is valuable, piecemeal, is futile. I can only choose to avoid giving up as much as possible, and trying to avoid encouraging the harvesting by not transacting with known harvesters.

So to say the real story is the utilization of the info is true in that that is the “news”, and that the privacy lesson is old, but that privacy lesson has still never been learned. It can't be repeated enough, because people just aren't getting it.

Or maybe I missed your point  :P
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random axe

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Re: Geek Talk
« Reply #1349 on: May 19, 2018, 05:52:26 PM »
WELL, a lot has to do with "value", which partly needs to be calibrated to a particular entity.

Your data has some value to you, and to your friends, depending.  Varies a lot.

Your data has some value to Facebook, mostly because they can sell it.  What Facebook mostly needs is the plausible appearance of some kind of utility of data, multiplied by some alleged amount of data. 

Most companies that buy it probably aren't making good use of it, but it's sexy and 'important' to buy it.  Also, advertising is mysterious and insane nowadays.  The days of just buying an ad of a certain size in the paper are long gone, and even buying an ad of X number of seconds during Y part of prime time is a largely outdated concept.  Targeting is a huge deal, and you need data to do it.  And then did it work?  You need to buy more data!  It starts off fairly stupid and gets worse.

You probably don't want your nudes sold online, but most corporations don't want your nudes, anyway.  (Nothing personal.)  They probably don't care who your dentist is, but they do want to know how much you pay your dentist in a given year.

Do I personally care if the corporate internet knows how much I spend on dentistry?  I mostly don't care.  Do I care if they carelessly leave that information online, tied to my name?  Yeah, much more irritating. 

But I think the much bigger deal is how Facebook seeks to extract data against the users' wishes, and how corporations seek to use it to screw with the fundaments of society, and how politicians rush to undermine our government using those corporations.  Those are much worse problems.