Author Topic: signs of change  (Read 42180 times)

hajen

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hajen

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random axe

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Re: signs of change
« Reply #17 on: January 24, 2009, 10:36:04 AM »
What I like is how the Banana Republicans are claiming that people released from Gitmo have gone on to be terrorists (including becoming one of the many al Qaeda second-in-commands) . . . and therefore this proves that Gitmo is doing a great job and shouldn't be closed down.  What, because they have a track record of releasing dangerous terrorists?  Or because they're releasing people who weren't terrorists until after their experiences at Gitmo?

Bush couldn't protect a walnut from an egg whisk, and he presided over the worst foreign attack on the US ever, not to mention our most disastrous foreign war.  Let's come not to praise him but to bury him.  Give Obama a chance to screw up a few times before we put them in competition.

eldiem

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Re: signs of change
« Reply #18 on: January 24, 2009, 11:56:09 AM »
One of my facebook friends changed his status to the following:

 Gee Mr. President, thank you SO much for giving me the opportunity to pay for womens' abortions! (more like an offer I can't refuse).


Nice.

Dr. Leonard HmofCoy

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Re: signs of change
« Reply #19 on: January 24, 2009, 12:06:59 PM »
I heard on NPR but missed the details, some general was being interviewed and he said something about people being released from Gitmo and going "straight back into the fight," and the interviewers said something like "how many, and who?" The general was apparently TOTALLY UNPREPARED for this completely obvious question and stammered a bit until finally coming up with the obligatory "that's classified."

Dude was making it up on the spot like Joe McCarthy. No doubt. It's a lot of shit.
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random axe

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Re: signs of change
« Reply #20 on: January 24, 2009, 01:11:45 PM »
It's idiotic either way.  They've admitted they're holding a lot of people who might be totally innocent.  And they've had their own people refuse to prosecute some of the 'best' prisoners because the prisoners were tortured.  And now they're claiming they let some go . . . and those ones turned out to be terrorists after all. 

This is not an argument for keeping the system in place.  And it's not like Obama's talking about closing the place and just letting all the prisoners run free, anyway.  He's just talking about moving them to a real, proper prison where they can undergo real, proper investigations and perhaps even real, proper trials.

One of the really important lessons here is that the military is really good at certain things -- and that's it.  A chainsaw is really good at certain things, but that doesn't mean you should use it to clean your teeth.  The so-so film from like ten years ago, The Siege, gave Bruce Willis a bunch of good dialogue, like the one where he says "The Army is a broadsword, not a scalpel."




Quote
Gee Mr. President, thank you SO much for giving me the opportunity to pay for womens' abortions! (more like an offer I can't refuse).

But, what, being taxed for funding to blow kids up is good thing?

eldiem

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Re: signs of change
« Reply #21 on: January 24, 2009, 01:45:21 PM »
Yeah I couldn't think of a good response.

Hedaira

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Re: signs of change
« Reply #22 on: January 24, 2009, 06:40:04 PM »
Yeah. That's one of those things best left unanswered because the potential of resulting drama is too high and totally not worth it.
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feffer

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Re: signs of change
« Reply #23 on: January 24, 2009, 07:16:38 PM »
No kidding.  Sometimes PetMe and OOB and OOB's friends get into it on facebook.  It's ugly.
Cause you're so beautiful
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Talix

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Re: signs of change
« Reply #24 on: January 26, 2009, 10:22:40 AM »
That's why I avoid checking/commenting on most of what my "friends" say.  Although it would be kind of awesome to watch someone take down my aunt... 

 :hmm:
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mo

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Re: signs of change
« Reply #25 on: February 04, 2009, 12:12:48 PM »

I really like this guy.

Quote from:  Barack Obama
But in order to restore our financial system, we've got to restore trust. And in order to restore trust, we've got to make certain that taxpayer funds are not subsidizing excessive compensation packages on Wall Street.

We all need to take responsibility. And this includes executives at major financial firms who turned to the American people, hat in hand, when they were in trouble, even as they paid themselves their customary lavish bonuses. As I said last week, that's the height of irresponsibility. That's shameful. And that's exactly the kind of disregard for the costs and consequences of their actions that brought about this crisis: a culture of narrow self-interest and short-term gain at the expense of everything else.

This is America. We don't disparage wealth. We don't begrudge anybody for achieving success. And we believe that success should be rewarded. But what gets people upset and rightfully so are executives being rewarded for failure. Especially when those rewards are subsidized by U.S. taxpayers.

For top executives to award themselves these kinds of compensation packages in the midst of this economic crisis is not only in bad taste it's a bad strategy and I will not tolerate it as President. We're going to be demanding some restraint in exchange for federal aid so that when firms seek new federal dollars, we won't find them up to the same old tricks.

As part of the reforms we are announcing today, top executives at firms receiving extraordinary help from U.S. taxpayers will have their compensation capped at $500,000 a fraction of the salaries that have been reported recently. And if these executives receive any additional compensation, it will come in the form of stock that can't be paid up until taxpayers are paid back for their assistance.

Companies receiving federal aid are going to have to disclose publicly all the perks and luxuries bestowed upon senior executives and provide an explanation to the taxpayers and to shareholders as to why these expenses are justified. And we're putting a stop to these kinds of massive severance packages we've all read about with disgust; we're taking the air out of the golden parachute.

We're asking these firms to take responsibility, to recognize the nature of this crisis and their role in it. We believe that what we've laid out should be viewed as fair and embraced as basic common sense.

Finally, these guidelines we're putting in place are only the beginning of a long-term effort. We're going to examine the ways in which the means and manner of executive compensation have contributed to a reckless culture and quarter-by-quarter mentality that in turn have wrought havoc in our financial system. We're going to be taking a look at broader reforms so that executives are compensated for sound risk management and rewarded for growth measured over years, not just days or weeks.

We've all got to pull together and take our share of responsibility. That's true here in Washington. That's true on Wall Street. The American people are carrying a huge burden as a result of this economic crisis: bearing the brunt of its effects as well as the costs of extraordinary measures we're taking to address it. The American people expect and demand that we pursue policies that reflect the reality of this crisis and that will prevent these kinds of crises in the future.

Thank you.
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Talix

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Re: signs of change
« Reply #26 on: February 04, 2009, 01:28:14 PM »
Now if only the people he chose to help him lead actually were taxpayers...:nonplused:
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random axe

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Re: signs of change
« Reply #27 on: February 04, 2009, 03:37:44 PM »
True, but I have no doubt that 90% of the people in the last administration -- and in the three or four prior, too -- were in the same not-paying-all-the-taxes boat.  The difference is the level of scrutiny, not the level of self-entitled misbehavior.  And, to be fair, these aren't people who do their own taxes.  I bet Daschle's tax forms and addenda run to over 100 pages just for the federal filing.  I'm sure his accountant is under pressure to get every deduction he can get away with, and I'm sure Daschle found out about the shoulda-filed-and-didn't issue and hoped he could just get away with it.  But it's a different form of misbehavior than the press and critics tend to make it out to be.  Still wrong, but not the same kind of wrong.

The government-lobby-government thing is frankly more deserving of close scrutiny, if you ask me.


There were analysts all over, today, saying that the problem with Obama's decision isn't that he isn't entitled to tell corporations what they can pay their execs (which was the whine I expected) but that this will make institutions less likely to seek federal assistance.  Putting aside a whole bunch of objections to that logic . . . if you're the CEO of a big bank, and the bank's failing so hard that it needs billions in handouts, and you decide to just let the bank fail so you can make an extra million bucks, well, shouldn't the press and/or board and/or stockholders and/or government call that to light and say, 'Hey, you douchebag, you're fired.'?  It's like letting your family starve so you can have a big-screen TV.

If regulators, et al, are paying attention like they should be, then that shouldn't be a problem.

feffer

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Re: signs of change
« Reply #28 on: February 04, 2009, 03:42:47 PM »
There were analysts all over, today, saying that the problem with Obama's decision is... that this will make institutions less likely to seek federal assistance. 

WUT.

I thought most people who object to the cap would be the same people who object to the bailout in the first place. 
Cause you're so beautiful
Like a tree
Or a high-class prostitute
You're so beautiful
Mmm, you could be a part-time model
But you'd probably have to keep your normal job

random axe

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Re: signs of change
« Reply #29 on: February 04, 2009, 03:48:31 PM »
Quote
I thought most people who object to the cap would be the same people who object to the bailout in the first place.

Yeah!  I thought of that too.  I'm not sure if I think that's good or bad, though.  But, yeah, it's weird that the same people are complaining about both things, with that logic.

I have to say, too, that I'm really kind of surprised by the balls on the GOP right now.  The latest Gallup poll (from a couple of days ago) showed their approval dropping to the point that if the election were today, they'd theoretically pick up less than 20 electoral votes, and the governors are all ganging up on them, too.  I don't see how they can win by stalling this stimulus.  It seems more sensible for them to make a big show of giving in -- and then complain later about the overspending.  (Not that I wish they would.  It just seems like that would be their best partisan move.)


Also saw today that Palin attacked Ashley Judd (as an "extremist" because of her environmental views).  Uh, Palin, I think you're out of your weight class, there.  But Ashley might be too nice to really retaliate.